r/PowerScaling • u/JollySelection2336 Anti goku glazer/wanker • Jul 19 '24
Well low outerversal honkaiverse is now a thing Games
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u/GokuSolosFodderine Leader of Gokuism Jul 19 '24
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u/ReadySource3242 Jul 19 '24
They really took something from a normally badly translated franchise out of context and then pretended it was about dimensions.
In any case, none of the proofs are statements, all of them are “theories” that constantly shift and get retconned
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u/Murky_Blueberry2617 Hebi Sasuke is Universal+ frfr Jul 19 '24
How does anyone even understand half of the nonsensical sci-fi rambling in that game??
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u/ReadySource3242 Jul 19 '24
They don’t. Everyone who claims they understand it likely read a mistranslated part or misunderstood a part.
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u/WillingnessAnxious37 Jul 19 '24
Someone mentioned it but being low 1-A with apparently only FTL speeds is kind of insane lmao literally all you would need is someone deep into MFTL or infinite speed and it's almost an immediate incon/loss depending on hax.
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u/ThisIsMyPassword100 Jul 19 '24 edited Jul 19 '24
Speed wise she’s actually downplayed, her Bullet of Finality is pretty explicitly MFTL+ (~1870x lightspeed) from traveling at least 4,499 AU in 20 minutes (fired from the moon, which is 1 AU from the sun).
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u/GokuSolosFodderine Leader of Gokuism Jul 19 '24 edited Aug 10 '24
Her finality bullet traveled solar system to qiming which was at the boundary of solar system so it was around Heliopause
Heliopause is about 123 astronomical units from sun. You are using oor cloud calculation, Planet Qiming is NOT that far
So lets calculate it, Kiana shoot the bullet from Moon to Qiming in 20 minutes. 122 AU distance since moon and Sun distance is 1 AU
1 AU (astronomical unit) = 149,597,870.7 km Distance to heliopause = 122 AU Distance in km = 122 AU × 149,597,870.7 km/AU
20 minutes = 20 × 60 seconds = 1200 seconds
122 AU × 149,597,870.7km/AU = 18,251,552,030.4km (probably slightly wrong)
20 min = 1200 seconds
18,251,552,030.4km/1200 = 15,209,626.7km this is the speed of kianas bullet
Speed of light = 299,792.458km
15,209,626.7km/299,792.458km = 50,73x SoL
STILL FTL 😭💀
Also there is no confirmation about Kianas average attacks have same speed of her bullet. Its not called a bullet attack for a reason
Just because a human uses a gun does this mean he is now speed of bullet?
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u/Visible_Astronaut416 Jul 23 '24 edited Jul 23 '24
It’s actually around 6 minutes, not 20 minutes. 20 minutes referred to when Kiana was talking with Prometheus on the moon, and Prometheus said that Kiana still has 13 mins 23 secs before she could start shooting her bullet. It is 4499 because the distance between the planet and the sun is said to be 4500 au, and the distance between Earth and the Sun is 1 AU.
4499 AU=6,7304082x10¹⁴ meters
Time=6 minutes and 37 seconds= 397 seconds
Speed=1,69531693x10¹² m/s
Times faster than light: 5.654,96857 times, round up to 5655 So yeah that’s MFTL+
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u/verywholesomealt Aug 10 '24
The Honkai verse does actually have someone very, very deep into MFTL:
Lan, Aeon of the Hunt, from HSR, shot an arrow that traveled 62 light years in 30 minutes (english translation says half a system second, but cn translation says half a system time, and system time = an hour). Makes him millions of times FTL.
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u/Smashmaster777 Jul 19 '24
Dawg this is the reasoning for Low 1-A? I can get like 50 verses to Low 1-A with this
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u/Mission_File_4942 Sonic can win against your character somehow Jul 19 '24
Wake up baby, outer yoriichi and Deku is no longer a dream 🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥
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u/ReadySource3242 Jul 19 '24
Now I can claim Gilgamesh is boundless because he’s been called Omnipotent
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u/_nitro_legacy_ My Glorious Banger ARGUS BANGS the fictional reality Jul 19 '24
MY GOAT ARGUS IS NOW BANGFINITE LAYERS OF BANGBOUNDLESS
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u/Either-Warning-1700 Jul 19 '24
A quick reminder:
They'll upgrade whatever they want.
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u/Murky_Blueberry2617 Hebi Sasuke is Universal+ frfr Jul 19 '24
I remember that guy, dude downplays Naruto all the time
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u/Icy-Dragonfruit-4104 Jul 19 '24
Honestly kinda agreed with him there.
gaara being 4x stronger than the sage of six paths makes zero sense whatsover.
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u/ThisIsMyPassword100 Jul 19 '24 edited Jul 19 '24
As someone who thinks Hoyoverse has some outer arguments, their reasoning for getting her to outer is awful. They don’t even have actual proof of getting them to 1B/1A. I’m pretty sure it’s supposed to chain scale, but the characters they’re scaling off of don’t have pages.
Realistically her scaling should be “low 1C, possibly high 1C.” Outer is possible, but not definitive, which is something that this sub and r/powerscales seem to agree with (https://www.reddit.com/r/PowerScaling/s/SLwTeiZWMf , https://www.reddit.com/r/PowerScaling/s/RBq4GPyCFq , https://www.reddit.com/r/powerscales/s/86nsxmhla8, https://www.reddit.com/r/PowerScaling/s/2oLKtSpJnW, https://www.reddit.com/r/powerscales/s/OQEpcGRoZH).
Honestly don’t know why this is getting attention, VSBW Hoyoverse should have been ignored when they started pushing high 1C Welt.
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u/ReadySource3242 Jul 19 '24
Kiana is high 1C based on HAX and specific countering, not on pure destructive capability. She’s barely shown a small planetery feat and all the high 1C feats are just like, by products of a natural law. Her durability isn’t really that high either, given a barely continental feat was able to stun her predecessor for a good amount of time.
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u/ThisIsMyPassword100 Jul 19 '24
She’s confirmed as equal to the CoF, which is confirmed as a higher dimensional structure (even more than the Tree) several times. She herself is even directly stated to transcend all dimensions.
Going by DC feats, regular Honkai Beasts get to planetary, and through chain scaling from Welt and very consistent statements, Herrschers can get to star level, Solar for Finality Based Herrschers.
Cosmology is also only reasonably 6D, 11D is a highball based on insufficient proof.
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u/ReadySource3242 Jul 19 '24
The person who stated that was Schrodinger, not Kiana. Honkai Beasts have never shown planetary feats, Herrscher have shown continental over a WEEK. In general Herrschers are only meant to wipe the surface and only at the speed of maybe empowered natural disaster.
Also I need the scan where they said the CoF is above the tree
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u/ThisIsMyPassword100 Jul 19 '24
For the CoF 1. It is higher dimensional 2. It is supposed to be extremely difficult to Embrace it due to the number of dimensions between humans and the CoF. This is all after Otto fuses with enough dimensions to steal power from the Tree. 3. God’s Domain is referred to as above the Tree 4. The CoF views everything from a higher dimension 5. Kiana transcends all dimensions and is equal to the CoF
For the planetary Honkai Beasts. There’s also HSR Welt being able to heavily damage the Doomsday Beast, who could destroy planets.
For the Star level Herrscher meta 1. Durandel’s Bubble World contains an entire solar system 2. Several reliable sources confirm that DA Durandal scales to her Bubble World, including several statements from the writers and Su (who made the armor) 3. The first and second Herrscher cores contain equal energy as Durandel’s Bubble world, and they have the less energy than other cores (image 5) 4. Welt describes his self destruction as a supernova 5. Several weapons have been said to have the power of the stars in some form, including Astral Divide: Pisces, The Might of An-Utu, Starlance Prime, Sagittarius Astrea 6. HSR Welt is at best equal to his prime self, where he was one of the weakest Herrschers, and he’s at the bare minimum relative to Base Dan Heng, who could one shot star swallong monsters 7. Argenti lost to the Trailblazer (once again, Welt is at least relative to the TB), and he could pierce the hide of the Giant Sting, which had an entire starry sky inside of it (Welt confirms this isn’t an illusion)
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u/ReadySource3242 Jul 20 '24
Ok, lemme write as I read this
Standard enough
It is supposed to be extremely difficult to Embrace it due to the number of dimensions between humans and the CoF. This is all after Otto fuses with enough dimensions to steal power from the Tree.
Seems standard enough
Ok, I must be blind because I can't see anything that says that it's above the tree. It only says "He has to enter the realm of God" and to that he has to ascend the tree.
I'm not sure if english is your first language, but ascend does not mean "To go above", it just means to go up, to climb. Ascending the tree does not imply the realm is above the tree in any way
So do higher dimensional beings, so that doesn't prove much. Hell, Ryusuke had that view for a time
Statement is too vague. That can mean a number of things. Did you check the chinese dialogue to clarify? Also it's by schrodinger, part of the trio that constantly spout theories yet rarely proves or gets them right and constantly changes those theories
Is this using google translate or something? Abyssal beast has never been used to refer to a honkai beast in the en version, and neither Houkai nor BengHuai translates to abyssal in anyway.
There’s also HSR Welt being able to heavily damage the Doomsday Beast, who could destroy planets.
Yes, but HOW does it destroy planets? Raw power? Suicidal bomb? Destabilizing the planet's core by digging down? It can mean a number of things, and it never showed planet level power. Just because they say "This thing is a planet destroyer" could also mean it's a one use situational power. Otherwise beating someone like, I dunno, Deidara means you can destroy a city despite his final attack being a suicide move that vastly eclipses everything else.
Ok
Several reliable sources confirm that DA Durandal scales to her Bubble World, including several statements from the writers and Su (who made the armor)
Only when wearing the armor. She can't wield that power unless she dons the armor.
The first and second Herrscher cores contain equal energy as Durandel’s Bubble world, and they have the less energy than other cores (image 5)
I just want to remind you that there's a difference between amount of power you can contain and power you can actually wield. Because Herrschers have limited output, but can store a lot of energy, which is different.
"Going supernova" has been used as a sort of slang term for either getting super hyped, getting a super boost, or just exploding. It doesn't necessarily equate to a literal supernova or else someone saying that they're about to "Go nuclear" would be taken literally every time in a debate.
Several weapons have been said to have the power of the stars in some form, including Astral Divide: Pisces, The Might of An-Utu, Starlance Prime, Sagittarius Astrea
Star in most cases does not mean a ltieral star but more flowery language as those weapons are based off constellations. An Utu might have an argument but it's showcase against the PE HoFin puts the statement to AT MOST the heat of a supernova, not the power.
HSR Welt is at best equal to his prime self, where he was one of the weakest Herrschers, and he’s at the bare minimum relative to Base Dan Heng, who could one shot star swallong monsters
I dunno, the path seems to empower people a bunch. Also I hate that statement for how much it screws up powerscaling arguments because it's inconsistent with how an Emanator's highest showing was destroying a solar system.
Argenti lost to the Trailblazer (once again, Welt is at least relative to the TB), and he could pierce the hide of the Giant Sting, which had an entire starry sky inside of it (Welt confirms this isn’t an illusion)
Pretty sure he's talking about the Giant Sting, not the stars inside it. Cause March was like "Was that giant bug an illusion" and then Welt was like "No." Different viewpoints I guess.
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u/Visible_Ad_7540 Jul 20 '24
"Is this using google translate or something? Abyssal beast has never been used to refer to a honkai beast in the en version, and neither Houkai nor BengHuai translates to abyssal in anyway."
This is from Venus and there Honkai was called the Abyss.
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u/Visible_Ad_7540 Jul 20 '24
"Herrscher have shown continental over a WEEK. "
Fucking Cecilia showed a continental feat and she's below the Herrschers.
Himeko burned Australia in a week, but that doesn't mean she's barely city level.
The fact that she was playing slowly makes much more sense, given that the small rest of Shamash's energy (a weapon that is made of it and in a mode that is equal to Himeko in energy outpod) made a multi-continental feat.
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u/ReadySource3242 Jul 20 '24
Fucking Cecilia showed a continental feat and she's below the Herrschers.
Scan?
Himeko burned Australia in a week, but that doesn't mean she's barely city level.
Never said that, don't put your delusions into my mouth.
The fact that she was playing slowly makes much more sense, given that the small rest of Shamash's energy (a weapon that is made of it and in a mode that is equal to Himeko in energy outpod) made a multi-continental feat.
Shamash is stockpiling energy and unleashing it at once, and every time it did a multiple continental feat it required the core to be super charged but at least a herrscher's worth of energy. Herrschers in the PE couldn't gain sentiance for long periods of times and were generally just going berserk and all out. There's no reason to believe that she was holding back in any regard.
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u/Visible_Ad_7540 Jul 20 '24
"Scan?"
She dispelled a storm bigger than the Baltic Sea with one sweep of her spear.
https://act-webstatic.hoyoverse.com/manga/static/comic/book/1005/36/0006.jpg
"Never said that, don't put your delusions into my mouth."
You said that they act with the force and speed of powerful natural disasters.
"Shamash is stockpiling energy and unleashing it at once, and every time it did a multiple continental feat it required the core to be super charged but at least a herrscher's worth of energy. Herrschers in the PE couldn't gain sentiance for long periods of times and were generally just going berserk and all out. There's no reason to believe that she was holding back in any regard."
Shamash needed a charge of 150%, and then 300% above the safe amount of Cleaver of Shamash mode in order to switch to Zeroth Power, Shamash's true form, in order to access the power that Herrscher had during his lifetime.
Zeroth Power is what Himeko is capable of with her attacks.Not some kind of super trick for which she has to charge energy or take it from external sources.
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u/ReadySource3242 Jul 20 '24
Wrong, she killed the psuedo herrscher making the storm which led to it being dispersed. Maybe read the manga instead of taking scans out of context
Yeah, and a hurricane and earthquake can produce more energy then a ten nuclear bombs per second, so you’re still being delusional. Also I said empowered, maybe pay attention.
Zeroth Mode is just the strongest thing a divine key can use, there’s no statement that says it’s releasing the original power. It can exceed what a herrscher’s max output temporarily if they supercharge it. Given Kevin is explicitly more powerful then your average Herrscher, him using An Utu and going all out with it would exceed even Himeko.
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u/Visible_Ad_7540 Jul 20 '24
The storm began to develop even before Pseudo Herrscher died, Cecilia told her spear to blow away this storm before throwing.
Why don't you follow your advice and read the manga?
First of all, Zeroth Power is not the strongest possible form, just the one that releases the power of Herrscher during life.
Here is the description of Zeroth Power, Divine Key for a short time gets access to the power that Herrscher had during his lifetime.
Kevin released 3 more Shamash forms more powerful than this one.
Zeroth Power:Might of An Utu(equal Himeko)is the default mode for him and he casually activates it by touching it in the Base Form. A more serious form for him is Shuhadaku Uriel, which is stronger than Zeroth Power and even then it broke down unable to withstand his might when he gives his best at 100%.
Shamash needed to strengthen the Authority of Finality and 2 new forms from this so that Kevin would not break it when he fought at full strength.
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u/ReadySource3242 Jul 20 '24
The storm began to develop even before Pseudo Herrscher died, Cecilia told her spear to blow away this storm before throwing.
You know why I just sent five imgaes of that entire scene? It's to tell you one word.
BULLSHIT.
God, not only do you lie, you make stuff up about the actual source, stuff your own delusions into my mouth, AND every single fucking time fail to do proper research.
And for good measure, I checked the CHINESE version to call you bullshit. AND IT WAS THE SAME. Yeah, so you're wrong in two fucking languages you moronic dipshit.
So at this point, I'm no longer debate you. Every comment you've made has been full of misconceptions, lies, and stuff you made up yourself.
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u/Godofmytoenails Jul 19 '24
Lmao what? Who in the fuck made that. Kiana doesnt even have a planetary feat lmfao, its THEORIES on Hi3 manga that they made this shit from.
Only GGZ is arguably scaling there
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u/David89_R Egg Wizard Fanboy Jul 19 '24
Magolor victims
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u/No_Roof0642 Sakura Hater Jul 19 '24
Wait isn't 1A means you are above dimensionality then how come you still have ftl speeds?
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u/InfiniteX5 Ben 10 Glazer Jul 19 '24
1-A yes, low 1-A no. CSAP (which is what this sub uses) doesn't have a low 1-A tier, but on VSBW (where the image is from), it used to just mean aleph 1 dimensions, but now it means characters equal to the Von Neumann universe, or in other words, characters that represent/can affect structures representing the totality of mathematics, including any extensions of dimensionality.
You actually can have only FTL speed while being at this tier, but only if your AP is low 1-A while your existence isn't, since being able to move throughout infinite dimensional space would give you infinite speed by default as VSBW even directly states.
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u/ReadySource3242 Jul 19 '24
Hi3 is very overwanked by the fans. 90% the proofs is either by flowery language, exaggerations, mistranslation, misunderstandings and theories said by characters that have been wrong like, multiple times
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u/HolderOfDeliverance Horniest mf on here Jul 19 '24
Umienko still gaps in scaling and writing neg diff
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u/Izanagi_end Jul 19 '24
I don't really care, as long as no one ruins the story and game for me.
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u/CampaignImportant462 Aug 11 '24
Game and story are nice, the problem is fan are wank them to outerversal
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u/loksbe SUPER SPINO GOD SUPER SPINO KAIO-KEN X10000000000000000000000000 Jul 19 '24
All I'm getting from this is that she's a Dante victim.
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u/_nitro_legacy_ My Glorious Banger ARGUS BANGS the fictional reality Jul 19 '24
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u/Ok_Try_1665 Customizable Flair Jul 19 '24
Scaling gacha games is really dangerous cos of how inconsistent they can be, more inconsistent than comic books cos they really don't prioritize scaling and more gameplay and story
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u/_nitro_legacy_ My Glorious Banger ARGUS BANGS the fictional reality Jul 19 '24
Me when I see another "valid" dimensionional scaling
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u/_nitro_legacy_ My Glorious Banger ARGUS BANGS the fictional reality Jul 19 '24
Someone tag the dude that has "hoyoverse scales to 6d" flair. Bro needs to see this shit
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u/_nitro_legacy_ My Glorious Banger ARGUS BANGS the fictional reality Jul 19 '24
Where does Kevin scale here?
I recall Kevin should be stronger than HoFin Kiana by a large margin. Fuhua only states the Trio are equal power to Kevin but in 1v1 Kevin massively out stats them.
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u/JollySelection2336 Anti goku glazer/wanker Jul 19 '24
So i checked and he has the same tier
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u/_nitro_legacy_ My Glorious Banger ARGUS BANGS the fictional reality Jul 19 '24
What about aeons? They should scale higher then them no? Since They're closer to the tree.
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u/ThisIsMyPassword100 Jul 19 '24 edited Jul 19 '24
Most Aeons don’t actually scale much higher, aside from HooH who scales to the Tree directly. They’re like solar system level for the most part from scaling off of Overlords and Emanators.
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u/_nitro_legacy_ My Glorious Banger ARGUS BANGS the fictional reality Jul 19 '24
Solar system lvl is downplay tbh. The literal emanator of order in penacony that the Trailblazer fought was already solar system lvl.
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u/ThisIsMyPassword100 Jul 19 '24
All we know is that they’re far above solar system level characters, so not enough to take them any higher.
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u/_nitro_legacy_ My Glorious Banger ARGUS BANGS the fictional reality Jul 19 '24
Didn't the Swarm Disaster afflicted by Tayzzyronth literally affected multiple parts of the universe?
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u/ThisIsMyPassword100 Jul 19 '24 edited Jul 19 '24
Yeah, but that was overtime, not a single feat. So far the best single feat that Aeons scale off of is destroying solar systems, with HooH specifically scaling to low 1C for fusing with the Tree (11D, but there’s only proof of 6 large dimensions).
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u/_nitro_legacy_ My Glorious Banger ARGUS BANGS the fictional reality Jul 19 '24
Didn't 9 aeons HooH included were edging their shits trying to kill Tayzzyronth? I strongly think akivili, Terminus and HooH are equal in power and influence tbh. Terminus and Akivili are opposite paths of eachother(even tho they're good terms) HooH preety much is just the Scaler
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u/ThisIsMyPassword100 Jul 19 '24
I’m pretty sure HooH being in the fight means that THEY hadn’t fused to the Tree at that point, but I could be mistaken. In a situation that’s ambiguous like this, I’d say to lowball them.
Are Terminus and Akivili opposing Paths? From a narrative perspective sure (Penecony spoilers: such as the dynamic between the Nameless and the Stelleron Hunters), but Terminus is more grouped with Fuli and HooH (the 3 Aeons who preside over the death and rebirth of the universe), while Akivili kind of just does whatever.
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u/_nitro_legacy_ My Glorious Banger ARGUS BANGS the fictional reality Jul 19 '24
Yeah we need to handpoint gun the retard who scale them this high for no reason.
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u/_nitro_legacy_ My Glorious Banger ARGUS BANGS the fictional reality Jul 19 '24 edited Jul 19 '24
Imo Kevin should be here. Even in HoFin form she still loses to Kevin in 1v1. Fuhua said only the trio were equal to Kevin, if each one of them fight him in a 1v1 they lose badly.
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u/Prestigious_Mobile37 Jul 20 '24
Hmm. I have seen people commenting that she can defeat Anos Voldigoad. Is she really that strong??
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u/_nitro_legacy_ My Glorious Banger ARGUS BANGS the fictional reality Jul 20 '24
It's just their wankers. She barely even beats naruto high diff. Imagine having 11d hax but your strongest attack barely even deal any damage to a planet. Last I recall someone pointed out she manage to destroy a dwarf planet that's smaller than the moon. And that's it.
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u/PeaMother5475 Aug 16 '24
Hipocresía en Reddit una vez más. Wankean de manera puerca a DB y no dicen nada. Pero como tienen un odio irracional hacia Honkai, cualquier cosa que pase está mal.
Ah cierto, se me olvidaba mencionar que también hacen lo mismo con Nasuverso. Cualquier mierda que se diga lo toman literal, solo Honkai está mal aunque los otros demuestren menos o directamente no lo hagan
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